|
Post by eek on Jan 21, 2006 10:02:56 GMT -5
That depends on your definition of free will. Humans do not make decisions, connections between brain cells do. Further, we are forced to follow laws and rules that constrict on our free will. That doesn't make sense. Brain cells are part of what we call a "human".
|
|
|
Post by Hunessai on Jan 21, 2006 10:13:36 GMT -5
On Regret:
Let's say that you could go through one of two doors. One door will lead you outside, and the other door will lead you to the bottom of a pit.
You choose a door, and you fall into the pit. Now, looking back on the event with the knowledge of what would happen if you picked that door, you wouldn't pick it. You would regret it, because now some factors of your memories have changed and are capable of dis-agreeing with your old self.
If it seems like a good idea to you at the time, you will do it.
|
|
|
Post by darkhelmet on Jan 21, 2006 14:01:33 GMT -5
Reminds me of when we had to write an essay in 8th grade debating whether the events of Romeo and Juliet happened because of fate, or their own actions.
To this day I still don't know which it is in real life. And I probably will never know.
|
|
|
Post by illicit on Jan 21, 2006 14:11:51 GMT -5
On Regret: Let's say that you could go through one of two doors. One door will lead you outside, and the other door will lead you to the bottom of a pit. You choose a door, and you fall into the pit. Now, looking back on the event with the knowledge of what would happen if you picked that door, you wouldn't pick it. You would regret it, because now some factors of your memories have changed and are capable of dis-agreeing with your old self. If it seems like a good idea to you at the time, you will do it. There is only 1 way to find out if free will actually exists and thats to use something to erase memory and keep subjecting this person to the experiment.
|
|
mastab
Gallant
Orgasmic Flooding
Free hugs!
Posts: 2,781
|
Post by mastab on Jan 21, 2006 20:53:47 GMT -5
Are you suggesting we do that? I thought you were against scientists and doctors playing god.
|
|
|
Post by morty14 on Jan 22, 2006 21:39:33 GMT -5
Are you suggesting we do that? I thought you were against scientists and doctors playing god. I think he's just saying that is the only way it can be tested. On the topic: If we have no free will then all heaven/hell based religions must be wrong, as you couldn't be blamed for having the wrong brain functions. You can however be blamed for making the wrong choices. So this has wide ranging reprecussions if "proven". To know there is no free will would destroy the faith of billions. To say there is free will returns us to the status quo, as that is a widely accepted "fact".
|
|
mastab
Gallant
Orgasmic Flooding
Free hugs!
Posts: 2,781
|
Post by mastab on Jan 22, 2006 22:13:27 GMT -5
That depends on your definition of free will. Humans do not make decisions, connections between brain cells do. Further, we are forced to follow laws and rules that constrict on our free will. That doesn't make sense. Brain cells are part of what we call a "human". So you're saying that you are a lump of gray matter?
|
|
|
Post by eek on Jan 22, 2006 22:20:10 GMT -5
That doesn't make sense. Brain cells are part of what we call a "human". So you're saying that you are a lump of gray matter? No, I'm saying a lump of grey matter is a part of me.
|
|
|
Post by illicit on Jan 23, 2006 9:43:36 GMT -5
I am not saying I agree with the idea, but I understand exactly what hes saying. Until he gets that experiment going and proves me wrong I think there is free will....
|
|
mastab
Gallant
Orgasmic Flooding
Free hugs!
Posts: 2,781
|
Post by mastab on Jan 23, 2006 21:26:09 GMT -5
So you're saying that you are a lump of gray matter? No, I'm saying a lump of grey matter is a part of me. So part of you makes the decision, not all of you? That's not you deciding, is it?
|
|
|
Post by eek on Jan 23, 2006 21:33:09 GMT -5
We don't say "John's arm threw a punch at Bob" or "my legs walked to the park" do we.
|
|
mastab
Gallant
Orgasmic Flooding
Free hugs!
Posts: 2,781
|
Post by mastab on Jan 24, 2006 1:00:44 GMT -5
If we wanted to be correct we would.
|
|
Mumble
Squire
Forum Skull Avatar Guy
Posts: 1,645
|
Post by Mumble on Jan 24, 2006 2:29:08 GMT -5
If we wanted to be correct we would. Not really, the legs couldn't walk without the brain, and lungs, and heart, and many other parts of the body. All the parts are dependant, and require each other to function.
|
|
|
Post by illicit on Jan 25, 2006 18:56:59 GMT -5
If we wanted to be correct we would. Not really, the legs couldn't walk without the brain, and lungs, and heart, and many other parts of the body. All the parts are dependant, and require each other to function. exactly, the body is so well cordinated with eachother in its movements. How every muscle in the leg works together to walk.
|
|
mastab
Gallant
Orgasmic Flooding
Free hugs!
Posts: 2,781
|
Post by mastab on Jan 25, 2006 19:07:01 GMT -5
If we wanted to be correct we would. Not really, the legs couldn't walk without the brain, and lungs, and heart, and many other parts of the body. All the parts are dependant, and require each other to function. Yes we would, actually. The brain makes the decision, not you because you includes your legs, arms, heart, stomach, all of which have nothing to do with the decision. Unless every part of your body is doing an activity you are not doing it. The fact that our parts are seperate and need eachother does nothing to further your point.
|
|
|
Post by eek on Jan 25, 2006 19:21:43 GMT -5
Not really, the legs couldn't walk without the brain, and lungs, and heart, and many other parts of the body. All the parts are dependant, and require each other to function. Yes we would, actually. The brain makes the decision, not you because you includes your legs, arms, heart, stomach, all of which have nothing to do with the decision. Unless every part of your body is doing an activity you are not doing it. The fact that our parts are seperate and need eachother does nothing to further your point. What? I'm not breathing? I can't see? I'm not listening to the TV? Damn... I must be dead.
|
|
mastab
Gallant
Orgasmic Flooding
Free hugs!
Posts: 2,781
|
Post by mastab on Jan 25, 2006 19:55:29 GMT -5
Your lungs and the related muscles are breathing, your eyes and optical lobe are seeing, and your ears and brain are listening to TV. Not you.
|
|
|
Post by illicit on Jan 25, 2006 19:59:39 GMT -5
Your lungs and the related muscles are breathing, your eyes and optical lobe are seeing, and your ears and brain are listening to TV. Not you. Yet your brain sends signals to your lungs to make them breathe, and your brain interprets the light the comes from the tv and the sound from the speakers.
|
|
|
Post by eek on Jan 25, 2006 20:01:45 GMT -5
Your lungs and the related muscles are breathing, your eyes and optical lobe are seeing, and your ears and brain are listening to TV. Not you. Okay, so now we're debating whether or not our brains have free will? This is pointless. Do you actually say this things when talking to people in real life?
|
|
mastab
Gallant
Orgasmic Flooding
Free hugs!
Posts: 2,781
|
Post by mastab on Jan 25, 2006 20:03:38 GMT -5
Your lungs and the related muscles are breathing, your eyes and optical lobe are seeing, and your ears and brain are listening to TV. Not you. Yet your brain sends signals to your lungs to make them breathe, and your brain interprets the light the comes from the tv and the sound from the speakers. I never said the brain did not. Is there a point to what you just said?
|
|
mastab
Gallant
Orgasmic Flooding
Free hugs!
Posts: 2,781
|
Post by mastab on Jan 25, 2006 20:05:03 GMT -5
Your lungs and the related muscles are breathing, your eyes and optical lobe are seeing, and your ears and brain are listening to TV. Not you. Okay, so now we're debating whether or not our brains have free will? This is pointless. Do you actually say this things when talking to people in real life? No, this subject has never come up in real life. If it had I would argue same as I am doing here. I do not say 'my brain did this' in real life, I use the common 'I did this' whether it is incorrect or not.
|
|
|
Post by eek on Jan 25, 2006 20:08:50 GMT -5
Okay, so now we're debating whether or not our brains have free will? This is pointless. Do you actually say this things when talking to people in real life? No, this subject has never come up in real life. If it had I would argue same as I am doing here. I do not say 'my brain did this' in real life, I use the common 'I did this' whether it is incorrect or not. Okay, so despite arguing against incorrect terminology you use yourself, what bearing does this have on free will? Obviously you don't believe that "we" have free will, but since it's our brains that do all the work, surely our brains have free will?
|
|
mastab
Gallant
Orgasmic Flooding
Free hugs!
Posts: 2,781
|
Post by mastab on Jan 25, 2006 20:10:36 GMT -5
No, this subject has never come up in real life. If it had I would argue same as I am doing here. I do not say 'my brain did this' in real life, I use the common 'I did this' whether it is incorrect or not. Okay, so despite arguing against incorrect terminology you use yourself, what bearing does this have on free will? Obviously you don't believe that "we" have free will, but since it's our brains that do all the work, surely our brains have free will? The brain is told what to do by every nerve in the body. There is no one thing in us that makes a decision.
|
|
|
Post by eek on Jan 25, 2006 20:12:29 GMT -5
Okay, so despite arguing against incorrect terminology you use yourself, what bearing does this have on free will? Obviously you don't believe that "we" have free will, but since it's our brains that do all the work, surely our brains have free will? The brain is told what to do by every nerve in the body. There is no one thing in us that makes a decision. What, so now it's the nerves making the decisions? Please, try to be consistent.
|
|
mastab
Gallant
Orgasmic Flooding
Free hugs!
Posts: 2,781
|
Post by mastab on Jan 25, 2006 20:13:13 GMT -5
The brain is told what to do by every nerve in the body. There is no one thing in us that makes a decision. What, so now it's the nerves making the decisions? Please, try to be consistent. The nerves are part of the brain. I am perfectly consistent.
|
|